In a cataclysm known as the Nightfall, the worlds were almost completely destroyed by a harrowing surge of darkness.
In the shadows of the ensuing chaos a new group has taken shape. Led by an Aegyl named Kalos, the 11th Hour touts an esoteric knowledge of how to combat the darkness and restore the worlds. They might be the worlds’ best chance at survival; but nobody really knows enough about them to confirm or deny their claims.
On the brink of collapse, the universe holds its breath in anticipation. Of restoration? Of destruction? It is up to individuals like yourself to decide.
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Ah, I always forget about the retarded Castle Oblivion business and that according to the time-line, Roxas must have been running around (somewhere) during that trip. I can't help plot holes...it bugs me when writers alter the given circumstances to fit the character's actions instead of allowing the characters to change their actions based on given circumstances.
*jumps down into a plot hole* Sorry Squeenix, youz not getting any of my money for your next additions to the series.
EDIT: ooo, it just occurred to me, that if we take all the KH, CoM, and KHII events as FACT, then we know that Nobodies can grow. You'd think that means their organic, but then when they die, they just disappear...wild, man, wild! Mini-Roxas must have been adorable.
Sure, it could be argued that Roxas' growth is merely a reflection of Sora's growth because they are so closely connected, his body NOT being, in fact, organic (however, this leads one to wonder why they don't just look exactly the same if they are so in tune with one another) but the bottom line is, there should be some sort of incredibly in depth explanation as to why Roxas is separated from Sora. If Nobodies are created when a Heartless is formed, how did Roxas come about for a second time? He needs a body out of something. Someone explain to me why people have Nobodies in the first place if there are no repercussions when either party is separated.
Sora might want to wield Oathkeeper or Oblivion as well. I can't see them using the same keychains at the same time. It's not only pretty much impossible, but it's also one Heart supporting up to four keyblades at once...
There would either need to be an inclusion in the official plot that Sora can no longer wield those two Keyblades because his...not-body/not-spirit/not-actually-anything-apparently Nobody (maybe parasite living off brain waves?) is keeping them occupied, or some other very good explanation.
EDIT: I've edited this about fourteen million times. So...yeah, ignore anything before THIS edit...
Well in Castle Oblivion Roxas and Sora were able to wield the Oathkeeper and Oblivion Keyblades (as far as we know). I have no explanation for that however...does everything really need a clear cut explanation? Not everything in the games was explained so clearly and we all pretty much just accepted it. I'm really trying to make things less complicated than they are and I don't want to have to create more stories to confuse new members.
But I'll complicate things anyway. Now let's add Ven into all of this. Some have theorized that Roxas looks the way he does because he is actually Ven and/or he contains Ven's heart which is why he can wield the Keyblade. This would also explain why he has two. Ven's heart wields one and the strength of Sora's heart wields the other. So maybe just give Roxas Ven's Keyblade...? I don't know... It seems perfectly normal for the two characters to be able to wield the same blades. Maybe Roxas' Keyblades aren't Keychains and they're just the blades themselves while Sora's are the Keychains which changes his Kingdom Key into their forms.
I'm really not sure on this one. But everyone PLEASE keep in mind that we're trying to uncomplicate things.... This isn't a real video game, it's an RPG so not everything has to be perfectly explainable or make perfect sense. Hell, not even everything in the games does that!
I agree with everyone who has stated that Original Characters should have original keyblades. I love coming up with ideas for keyblades and sketching them, and I think a lot of people would like that same opportunity.
Second of all, I see no reason why Original characters could not get additional key chains to change the looks, stats and abilities of their original keyblade. The number of key chains a character can have should be limited, and even if the person is a dual weilder, they should be kept to that number. Random people shouldn't give out these key chains, but they should be like rewards from the staff.
I suppose characters would be able to receive key chains that Sora received, but they should have different effects that are dependent on the wielder. Who knows, there could be duplicate key chains since a keyblade is required to derive an effect, with the exception of one's like the Oathkeeper, of course. People may not even know what the key chain they just gave some random wielder could do. My Theory is that key chains only work the way they do based on the memories of the wielder.
I'll try to come up with viable theories for everyone...
-Aryn- A possibility in which a Nobody can be created from a Heartless with the maintenance of a Somebody could be due to the fact that Sora's heart is incredibly strong. This could mean that while Sora's entire body is transferred into the Nobody, the strength of his heart may provide the rest of the components required for a Nobody to exist. So Sora's 'body' was sustained solely by the strength of his heart and Kairi's feelings after he was restored from being a Heartless. So you could extract Roxas, and evenly distribute Sora's heart strength to keep them both together- as long as they don't come to close to each other, they can both exist independently. i.e. Person - Heartlessed - > Nobody + Heartless (For Sora, in KH) Sora - Heartlessed - > Heartless Sora (but with Heart-sustained body) + Roxas (For Sora, in WD) Sora - Scienced - > Sora (Heart-sustained body) + Roxas(Heart-sustained body) + Aros (perhaps come into existence due to the instability caused by the constant Heart fluctuations of Sora- maybe a piece broke away from Sora's heart and became Aros?)
-Roxas- On the contrary, there was never a time when Sora and Roxas could have both wielded Oathkeeper and Oblivion independently, apart from the first time Roxas was born after Sora became a Heartless. In Castle Oblivion, Sora never truly wielded Oathkeeper or Oblivion. All his keyblades were cards- figments of his memory. He wielded the memories of Oathkeeper and Oblivion, but never the Keyblades themselves. And since Sora was comatose during Roxas' time as an Organization member or fighting in Castle Oblivion, there's no chance that the 'keyblade paradox' could have happened.
Ven cannot be Roxas, since Roxas came to being way after Ven. Roxas cannot even have Ven's heart, since he was a Nobody, and by the meaning of their existence, Nobodies have no hearts. Roxas (to my belief), can only wield the Keyblade through his connection with Sora. None other is strong or well-reinforced enough to provide a completely alternate argument.
Maybe Square Enix wanted to deliberately avoid the Keyblade Paradox. Or maybe it happened by chance. One of the best solution to this I think is to probably give Roxas 'Keyblades of War' or 'Warblades'- Keyblades without keychains that can only destroy Heartless, but cannot lock Keyholes or whatnot.
-Orion- Additional keychains would be very difficult to regulate. If you wanted to create a keychain, wouldn't it be the same as creating keyblades? I suggest something like only Keyblade wielders can give out keychains, and only then of the keychain of their own keyblade. But even then, I'm not sure. It's a great idea, but there's a whole load of cons that go with it which we might not be able to deal with right at the beginning of Version 5.0, along with the changes we're making with the Keyblades, Wielders and Plots and all that jazz.
To me more than one person should be able to hold a keyblade. I mean I support Kioku. He explained it pretty good. I mean the keyblades could be obtained rply because im sure EVERY member doesn't want to make their own keyblade.
-Roxas- On the contrary, there was never a time when Sora and Roxas could have both wielded Oathkeeper and Oblivion independently, apart from the first time Roxas was born after Sora became a Heartless. In Castle Oblivion, Sora never truly wielded Oathkeeper or Oblivion. All his keyblades were cards- figments of his memory. He wielded the memories of Oathkeeper and Oblivion, but never the Keyblades themselves. And since Sora was comatose during Roxas' time as an Organization member or fighting in Castle Oblivion, there's no chance that the 'keyblade paradox' could have happened.
Ven cannot be Roxas, since Roxas came to being way after Ven. Roxas cannot even have Ven's heart, since he was a Nobody, and by the meaning of their existence, Nobodies have no hearts. Roxas (to my belief), can only wield the Keyblade through his connection with Sora. None other is strong or well-reinforced enough to provide a completely alternate argument.
Maybe Square Enix wanted to deliberately avoid the Keyblade Paradox. Or maybe it happened by chance. One of the best solution to this I think is to probably give Roxas 'Keyblades of War' or 'Warblades'- Keyblades without keychains that can only destroy Heartless, but cannot lock Keyholes or whatnot.
Ah, yes, very understandable. It doesn't matter to me either way if Roxas keeps his current Keyblades or gets new ones. I'm just trying to clear some of my own questions up. Well I could just give Roxas one Keyblade. He really doesn't need two and I don't understand why he has two anyway.
Why can't Roxas be Ven? Yes Ven was born much earlier, but who's to say Sora hasn't been housing Ven's heart? (I haven't been keeping up on KH history so if there's been some big revelation about Ven can someone please tell me? lol) Axel even said that it seemed like Roxas had a heart which can be the reason Axel was so drawn to him. Maybe when Sora became a heartless, Ven's heart was released in the process. This might explain why Roxas has two Keyblades and why he can wield one -- because somehow he still has a heart. I don't know though, just my thoughts.
Sora could not dual wield before we knew Roxas existed, correct? It's just strange how Roxas dual wields all the time while Sora can only do so in Drive forms.
-Roxas- On the contrary, there was never a time when Sora and Roxas could have both wielded Oathkeeper and Oblivion independently, apart from the first time Roxas was born after Sora became a Heartless. In Castle Oblivion, Sora never truly wielded Oathkeeper or Oblivion. All his keyblades were cards- figments of his memory. He wielded the memories of Oathkeeper and Oblivion, but never the Keyblades themselves. And since Sora was comatose during Roxas' time as an Organization member or fighting in Castle Oblivion, there's no chance that the 'keyblade paradox' could have happened.
Ven cannot be Roxas, since Roxas came to being way after Ven. Roxas cannot even have Ven's heart, since he was a Nobody, and by the meaning of their existence, Nobodies have no hearts. Roxas (to my belief), can only wield the Keyblade through his connection with Sora. None other is strong or well-reinforced enough to provide a completely alternate argument.
Maybe Square Enix wanted to deliberately avoid the Keyblade Paradox. Or maybe it happened by chance. One of the best solution to this I think is to probably give Roxas 'Keyblades of War' or 'Warblades'- Keyblades without keychains that can only destroy Heartless, but cannot lock Keyholes or whatnot.
Ah, yes, very understandable. It doesn't matter to me either way if Roxas keeps his current Keyblades or gets new ones. I'm just trying to clear some of my own questions up. Well I could just give Roxas one Keyblade. He really doesn't need two and I don't understand why he has two anyway.
Why can't Roxas be Ven? Yes Ven was born much earlier, but who's to say Sora hasn't been housing Ven's heart? (I haven't been keeping up on KH history so if there's been some big revelation about Ven can someone please tell me? lol) Axel even said that it seemed like Roxas had a heart which can be the reason Axel was so drawn to him. Maybe when Sora became a heartless, Ven's heart was released in the process. This might explain why Roxas has two Keyblades and why he can wield one -- because somehow he still has a heart. I don't know though, just my thoughts.
Sora could not dual wield before we knew Roxas existed, correct? It's just strange how Roxas dual wields all the time while Sora can only do so in Drive forms.
The main reason on why Roxas has two keyblades, I think, is to reflect on the duality of Roxas' existence- although he's an Organization member, which is meant to be evil, his Somebody, Sora, is the saviour of the worlds. Also, going by the Sora+Roxas connection theory, Sora could have passed on the importance of Riku and Kairi onto his Nobody. This would go further to reinforce the connection between Roxas and Sora which eventually led him back to find his Somebody. Going back to my aforementioned theory about Sora's heart allowing Roxas to exist, maybe Roxas would need the strength of two Keyblades to kepe his existence in check. In a vague sort of way, it could be Sora's heart and memories along with Kairi's heart's purity that also keeps Namine alive, too. So that's two to three factors which would contribute to maintaining their Nobodies' existence.
And on a sentimental value (completely negligible, but just thought I'd say it) Roxas wielding two Keyblades has become sort of iconic, and I'd hate to lose the Roxas pwning everybody with hot double-Keyblade action
And okay, your theory could be right. But surely the Organization would have noticed during the years he spent with them if he had a heart? And on a very tenacious point, when Sora impaled himself on the Unlocker, he freed two hearts, not three. But like I said, it's very tenacious, and it could be completely irrelevent. I still think it's due to the influence of Sora's unnaturally strong heart and feelings that Roxas was able to emulate emotions better than other Nobodies, as well as wield the Keyblade.
If you think about it, if a person stayed asleep for a whole year, even with the whole crazy memory restoration flower thing (courtesy of Namine), while the world moves on and enemies get stronger, it would be much tougher on the person in question to catch up. So Roxas became Sora's training while he was comatose. So by going by what I said in the first paragraph, Roxas would have had to learn how to wield two Keyblades, since he needs both of them to keep alive. So this necessity, which eventually became his strength and fighting style, passed onto his Somebody when he rejoined with him, although he would need to use drives in order to unlock that ability in his mind. That's my theory, anyway.
Post by Ellie who has 0% on Nov 10, 2008 11:13:12 GMT -4
Although Roxas can wield keyblades. Should he have diverse keyblades as well of seperate strands of memories similar to his significant other half?
As for Aros, his existence can be believable similar to the existence of Xehanort's heartless. Even after Ansem was destroyed by the light of Kingdom Hearts, a fragment stayed with Rikku. The same can be for Sora when he had changed into a heartless, while he was possessed by darkness once he gave the hearts within him to return Kairi's heart to...Kairi. By that small fragment of time Aros was born, but kept dormant in Sora for as a fragment.
We can say that Aros existence was expressed when Sora alters into his Anti-Form in Kingdom Heart 2. o-o All we need now is for either Organization XIII or DarkXII to attempt to strip the fragment of darkness out of Sora to create a piece of entity.
boooom << Sora's heartless >> roaming around << within the boundaries of nature. After all, hearts are composed of >> darkness and light.
Another theory: Also it can be expressed that Rikku had triggered Aros existence when he introduced a portion of Sora's inner darkness Shadow Sora, who is a purebreed heartless. With his control over the darkness, he stripped a dark fragment of Sora. >> I don't think the Shadow Sora was ever slayed, but returned to the corridors of darkness.
If so there would be two possible << Sora Shadows. Aros << and a post-Aros (but this one can be treated similar to a Riku Replica since both were created beyond natural formation, but manual.)
Even if there are >> two it would give a Dark XII a conflict at the thought of a heartless merging side with a nobody, so they look for the other fragment lost in the Realm of Darkness, the heartless produced by Rikku.
*shruggles* x.x I can continue making more << irrational rational XD
I think that people shouldn't just turn up with Keyblades. There should be a new kind of thread to deal with people receiving Keyblades. Like, when a wielder is born, they post a special Keyblade receiving thread where they gain the Keyblade.
And if the Keychain-giving thing ever happens, only wielders and world character should be allowed. Non-wielder canons should not have Keychains.
That sounds like Locue's idea for a board that he's been pulling for would fit the bill. It would be called In, Out and About. In would be Dives, keyblades and things that happen in similar sorts of inside places. Out would be Paths of Darkness and similar, things outside of any world - outside of all the worlds, places that aren't really places. About is for Space.
Someone would still have to run the dives.
As for Keychains, I agree we have to limit it somehow. Thing there is, if we do it by limiting it to World characters, we'll still get someone at some point who hands them out to all and sundry. And at the same time, an OC who it made sense to give that person a chain wouldn't be able to. If that sentence made any sense.
I guess the only way to deal with that would be to have someone in charge of that, too. I think the same person who has to be in charge of who gets Keys in the first place.