Kuu's Plotweaving Thread

[Kuu]

- Kuu's Plotweaving Thread -
So many are still waiting for their new beginning. Their birth by sleep. Even me. And even you.

Hi, everyone - this is Kuu. Though I haven't been back for very long, but after having checked through the various layers of the plot infrastructure on WD, I've been having a lot of thoughts, questions, ideas and concerns, so I decided to create this sort of 'plot-weaving' thread to write them down whenever they occur to me, as well as suggestions as to how one might cover various plotholes. Everything I post here is my own, and I do not intend to claim that I am representing the general opinion/view in any way. Another imperative thing I'd like to mention before starting is that this is in absolutely NO WAY a bitching session and that I am not picking out WD's weak points willynilly just for kicks - I'm honestly confused/concerned and at all times trying in my own way to perhaps help the site improve, plot-wise.

Anyway, here we go!

- Main Plot -
l i n k

i s s u e s
I'll begin with the main plot. Now, from what I can summarise of the main plot, the Organization have returned, while their Heartless have also risen up and they are now going head to head against each other, trying to take back over the World That Never Was. Along with this, Roxas has been ripped out of Sora's existence at some point and has been redrafted into the Organization.

Firstly, just a very minor point - I think it might be worth the main plot thread being cleaned up a little and put through a spell check. There aren't many huge errors, but little things like 'it's master' as opposed to 'its master' and 'those wills retain' as opposed to 'those will retain' just makes it seem as if more care was taken with it - after all, it is the main plot, and it's going to be one of the first things that new members see, so it's probably in our best interests to maintain at least perfect spelling and grammar there (we are, after all, an intermediate to advanced RP forum).

Secondly, Roxas' existence. The only way for Roxas to exist is for Sora to be stabbed with the Keyblade of People's Hearts again, since Roxas was originally the Nobody formed by Sora's body and soul, but Sora's restoration meant that the only thing that Roxas had left were his memories, which allowed him to continue existing. Roxas in the game was unable to remember anything due to his memories forming his physical form, but as Namine began to link the chains of memories back together, Roxas's existence began synchronising with Sora's, leading to him experiencing Sora's memories. This also explains why Xion grew stronger while Roxas grew weaker as she began absorbing more memories, as they were the basis of both their existence (indeed, her very purpose was to absorb Roxas using her Replica powers and become 'the new Sora'). Therefore, the idea that he can randomly pop up with conveniently no memories and then happily recruited is somewhat unlikely.

Secondly, what is it that Sora, Riku and Kairi are splitting up to do? The Organization and Dark XII are at each others' throats, so if they really wanted to get involved, they would probably try to take them both down. The Gates are open and Keyholes are closed (unless they're not, in which case they should be mentioned in the main plot), as well as the Keyhole to Kingdom Hearts, so what are they really out to do except to kill Heartless here and there? What 'pieces' are they helping pull back together? And even if that were so, surely their interests are the same and they should be working together? At the very least, shouldn't they be trying to work out what's actually happening / going to happen in the universe? The goal of the main plot appears very vague, and while it may be intended to be as loose as possible so that many other plot ideas can be woven into it, I feel that something with so many unused/unexplained plot elements sort of discourages direction in the plotline.

i d e a s
If Roxas is to once again reappear with the same power he held before, then they would somehow manage to find a way to reconstruct a body using Sora's memories and tap into the power of Sora's heart to give him Roxas' strength (I believe this is one of the reasons why the Riku Replica was defeated over and over again). Perhaps if they used data from the Replica Program, Operation Castle Oblivion and Garden of Assemblage on Sora's memories, they could use them to create a Replica (which is a Nobody of sorts) and get him to absorb the life force of someone powerful. Therefore, I think the best way to get a Roxas is to have the Organization create a Replica of Sora/Roxas.

I think it should be decided what phase the plot it is in in terms of what the good guys and bad guys are doing - like, are the Organization focusing on forming a new Kingdom Hearts (bearing in mind that they were building their first Kingdom Hearts for at least 9-10 years until it got blown up by DiZ) and are the Dark XII taking over worlds and/or searching for the Seven Princesses of Heart (as Ansem and the rest of the Disney Villain crew were doing for the 9 years between the destruction of Radiant Garden and the end of KH1), which would mean they would be currently in their 'preparation' phase. In the same way that the Organization and Dark XII are leading the 'evil' side of the conflict, the 'good' side ought to have some sort of direction, and I would have thought that Sora, Riku and Kairi would be the best choices (since Mickey has disappeared). Therefore, it might be good if they're given a plot or something to work towards - if they are also in 'preparation', then maybe getting stronger or trying to get more knowledge, or if they are in an 'active' phase, then perhaps discovering new worlds, skirmishing with the Heartless/Nobodies, leading groups of companions to take on the Organization/Dark XII or something - I just think that three of the most important characters to the KH plot are kind of being left hanging too loose.

- Dark XII and Organization XIII -
l i n k

i s s u e s
Next, I'll tackle the issue of the antagonists of WD - the Dark XIII and Organization XIII. In the first paragraph of the main plot thread, it states that once the Heart falls into the depths of darkness to become a Heartless, their empty shell becomes a Nobody, and that the strongest of those will retain human shape in both forms, and the strongest of Heartless are even capable of shifting their appearance. I don't believe this to be quite true.

The Heartless are split into Pureblood and Emblems, and from what I know, the Purebloods are pure darkness manifested from the darkness in one's heart after its collapse, which is why Purebloods inhabit the Realm of Darkness, which contains the darkness of everything in existence (as Kingdom Hearts contains the light of everything in existence). Emblems, on the other hand, are artificially created, and due to the fact that only Emblems can release hearts, I am led to believe that Emblems are in fact hearts which are engulfed by darkness.

The reason I am pointing this fact out is due to the nature of 'humanoid' Heartless. While the human-like nature of Heartless is increased by the strength of its previous self's heart, the power of Heartless is magnified by the amount of darkness in one's heart. This explains why Sora turned into a mere Shadow when he became a Heartless, as he did not have much darkness in his heart. Therefore, the power of the Dark XIII depends on how much darkness their original selves had. And considering the only human-like Heartless in canon existence is Xenahort's Heartless, that darkness would have to be intensely powerful. It is also known that the more powerful a Heartless, the more monstrous it is (and therefore don't really have that much control over their form), but the common feature is that they are mainly without discernible clothing. Now, many of the profiles that people on WD have made for the Dark XII usually involve them being both humanoid and clothed - which are not qualities of a Heartless (the only one being, again, Xenahort's Heartless).

The Organization's return is the other issue. Being Nobodies, they fade back into darkness, and other than being reformed within the darkness with their released hearts to become who they were before they became Nobodies, there is no way for them to suddenly appear out of the blue, because they have been erased from existence (by definition, they never really existed anyway).

i d e a s
I believe that the Dark XII would have been able to come into being in the variety of forms as people on WD have interpreted them to be if they were from the very beginning, extremely powerful Emblem heartless. Due to the artificiality of their nature, a greater degree of control over appearance would be possible. It also links with the fact that Emblems were the creation of Xenahort and the other apprentices, and it would make sense that the way in which they 'willingly gave their hearts to darkness' was that they used the machine on themselves. This would also explain why Xenahort was able to keep his mind intact, because his heart did not collapse, and the strength of his heart allowed him to keep his memories and thoughts in the same way as Sora when he became a Heartless, and due to the immense darkness already in his heart, he was able to maintain his human form. However, this would mean that the Dark XII would all have to have been created through the use of the Heartless-making machine in Radiant Garden, and had to have been particularly evil people to become such powerful Heartless. This should therefore be explained in the Dark XII's profiles i.e. a 'good' person could not have become as powerful a Heartless as a Dark XII member. In the same way, original characters who are humanoid Heartless (which, as far as I know, aren't meant to be allowed anyway) should have this in mind when creating their profiles.

The Organization could have been created in the same way as the theory I gave for Roxas - Vexen was known to have many Replicas of himself, and if one survived, he could have used the information in the Garden of Assemblage and the extensive knowledge he has already to activate the Replica Program once more and recreate the members of the Organization, strengthening their powers through the assimilation of Nobodies, or even better, the Absent Silhouettes (remains of the Organization XIII members). Therefore, the Organization could have been reborn as an Organization of Replica Nobodies.


More thoughts to come soon...

[Zephiris]

Well, I can clear up some thoughts for you, so let me begin. Forgive me ahead of time - it is late and this is all being typed up on an iPhone. xD

The Main Plot has just been edited in the past week and is, in fact, not 100% ready to go yet. Think more of 98.9%. The announcement thread announcing its large-scale edit is to come soon, as well as the thread accompanying it. Fine tunings such as spell checks can occur as the staff bring this update to WD. 

As far as Roxas and the Organization, a highly logical reason has been worked out for their return, Namine's, and the Dark XII. However, these are all blank points that are to be discovered with the unveiling of the site plot over time, primarily via roleplay. 

Many brilliant minds have gone into this contribution towards the site. Our goal was filling in many of the gaping holes left in the old plot. I thank you for bringing up some points, however. 

One point that confused me was your theory on the Dark XII's form / revival, which I see has direction but I cannot quite comprehend what that is. It was assumed that when Ansem's apprentices became Nobodies, their Heartless were born as well, but were trapped in the Realm of Darkness like Purebloods until Ansem Seeker of Darkness returned to release them. (An explanation for Ansem's return has been formed as well, but is also not included yet in the information currently presented to the public.)

The beginning of the new site plot is a rewrite of this paragraph in the very old one, written by the site's old owner:

When someone is turned into a Heartless, the empty shell they leave behind is known as a 'Nobody'. When someone with a very strong heart is turned into a Nobody, the Nobody retains its human form and has full memories as a human. Their Heartless has the same ability, but it can choose the form it bares. The Heartless of the Organization have been trapped in the Realm of Darkness for years, but their all-powerful leader, Ansem, has come back to claim them. He has persuaded each and every one of them to join his rankings to create the new group.

It was included because some reasoning had occurred in the past to make this paragraph true. You have a theory for countering it, which by all means  I'd like to try to understand, if you'd help me do so. 

In regards to the keyboards trio, they have split as their personal plots have taken them - at first. None knew of the Dark XII or Organization's return to begin with.  Kairi left the Islands first, wanting to cloak herself as another in order to train herself to stand on equal ground with Sora and Riku. Riku followed soon after he noticed her disappearance, angry at himself for letting her go alone and sitting idle on the Islands for a year. Very quickly he met with Zexion and Ienzo, learned the terrible truth of their return, and raced to the RGRUC to share his knowledge and find out more. He ran into a Disney knight and is actually now trying to reunite the three again. (Sora has left as well, though I'm not as informed on his whereabouts.)

As for their goals now, some of their main ones include finding the King, discovering how the Organization returned / Dark XII got here, trying to discover their goals and in doing so, counter them. The King has begun making his appearances among the Light again, to inform them of what he's learned in his absence and keep the plot moving. 

You're completely correct as far as what they should be doing, and believe me, they will. Things had to slow for our trio durning the huge process of rewriting the site plot, for many threads weren't made in case they would clash with any new information added. Luckily, that work is nearly complete, and the keybladers can get on the move again. 

[Kuu]

Okay, thanks for clearing up those points ^^ Like I said, I haven't been back for very long, so I wasn't aware of the plot overhaul. The rise of the Dark XII and Organization were never really explained while I was here years back, and so I felt I had to point it out after seeing that apparently it was still left unexplained - I'm glad it's been covered, and am looking forward to what you have in store

As for my Dark XII theory, I'll try to explain it as best as I can -

I - The Dark XII are not Pureblood Heartless

Purebloods do not have human-like forms, and their appearance is based on how much darkness the hearts they derived from held, and becomes more monstrous as they do. Neither are their abilities particularly variable - they all tend to revolve around the use of darkness in some manner, on different scales. They also have no sentience, and are blindly driven by the need to gain Hearts - direction to the Heartless in KH1 was given by those who were not Heartless due to this lack of intelligence.

However, the Dark XII are seen to exist in a variety of forms, many of them human. Their darkness power level as the Dark XII are more than enough to define them as monstrous-looking Heartless, and yet many of them are not. Their abilities are also extremely varied, and not always darkness-based (the current Ienzo uses Darkness, while the current Arlene uses lightning). They are also seen to be highly sentient beings, and can somewhat repress the irrational need for Hearts in order to achieve a greater goal. All of these point to the fact that the Dark XII cannot be Pureblood Heartless.


II - The Dark XII are Emblem Heartless

The Emblem Heartless came to be after a machine was created by Xenahort and the other apprentices that simulated the process of darkness engulfing a person's heart. They appear to be less primitive than Pureblood Heartless, often sporting armor/clothing and weapons, which are not characteristic of Purebloods (exempting the Orcus). They are also not pure darkness, and still contain Hearts, giving them a somewhat higher degree of intelligence and a wider (but not necessarily more powerful) skillset than Pureblood Heartless, including magic (e.g. Red Nocturne), weaponry (Zip Slasher) and special abilities (Search Ghost).

The Dark XII share the attribute of having a more sophisticated and in ways more human-like appearances than Purebloods, and also appear to wear clothing and often wield weapons. Their sentience can be put down due to the fact that they are not the result of manifest darkness after the collapse of a heart in the same way Purebloods are created, but in the same way Sora kept his memories when he became a Heartless, the hearts of the Dark XII remained with them and simply became engulfed in darkness, much in the way Emblem Heartless exist (as seen when they are killed, they release a heart, while Purebloods simply disappear). These hearts give the Dark XII their dangerous sentience, and also explains their varying abilities, and why, in some cases, they correspond to the abilities of their Nobodies, who who hold the power they held as humans.


III - The Dark XII were created by the Emblem Heartless Machine

When Xenahort and the other apprentices were said to 'give themselves up to the darkness', there are variable methods - allowing the Heartless to consume them, releasing their own Heart from their bodies etc. However, I am led to believe that they were created through the use of the Emblem Heartless Machine - a process which would allow them to keep the intelligence granted to them by their hearts, as well as maintain some degree of control over how they became Heartless (not sure how, but it is a machine after all, and I'm sure there were a few knobs and dials here that could be used to modify the process to make them stronger or give them certain abilities or something in a small/big way), which would somewhat explain their varying powers. It would also allow them greater control over the shaping of the darkness that form their bodies into something more human (or inhuman), which would explain the variety of forms the Dark XII take.


IV - The Dark XII were not all trapped in the Realm of Darkness

This last point is the most ambiguous, and I think my idea for this one has the most holes in, but nevertheless, I think that if the other Heartless could pull it off, then entities as powerful as the Dark XIII would have no trouble. It doesn't make sense that they are unable to leave if so many lesser Heartless were able. And it is said that they banished Ansem the Wise into the Realm of Darkness, so this implies that they were not initially in the Realm of Darkness - certainly DiZ did not mention their existence while he was there, and so he did not encounter them.

Maybe if the five apprentices (without Xenahort) had willingly stayed in the Realm of Darkness in an effort to increase their strength, it might make more sense - perhaps they were not yet powerful enough to act as independently as Xenahort's Heartless. In the process, they could have found the other six members that would make up the Dark XII, and with the return of Ansem, they were ready for action. The manner in which the other members could have become Emblem Heartless could vary - Isa and Lea are from Radiant Garden, so they might have finally succeeded in breaking into the castle and activated the machine, while the others could have been a result of them having their Hearts corrupted by Emblem Heartless.


Hope that made my Dark XII Revival theory a little clearer.

[Rook]

I think you are vastly overthinking things, and making it more complicated than it needs to be.

With that said, as Zeph mentioned, the site's plot is undergoing a drastic overhaul in order to help maintain the old familiar plot of the original World Destiny while at the same time trying to retract and undo the "fanfic" feeling and rational (or lack thereof) behind it. The "why and what for" of the greater majority of it has been worked out and redirected accordingly.

To that end, for months, the staffers and plot interns have been working to find as many plot holes as we can, and iron them out when necessary. Some things are left deliberately mysterious for the allowance of member's progressing and learning new things. Some are complicated to such an nth degree we are taking more time to try and work them out further.

However, I do agree on the point that the Dark XII Heartless being trapped in the Realm of Darkness. Without some form of reason, it doesn't quite stand to logic, and this is something I will be sure to confer with the other Plot Whores about.

And I also agree whole-heartedly on the subject of Roxas. My stance on him, his return, and his place in the plot have all been under heavy fire and I've no qualms saying I'm pulling the trigger. To the point where I think the rest of the plot team is getting sick of be bringing it up. Nothing about him past KH2 makes any sense in any form, and does nothing but damage the intent and purpose of the character. But god forbid, he's playable, emo, the girls like him, and as such I doubt we will ever have a consensus on getting rid of him. Which strikes me as tragic.

[Kuu]

Yeah, overthinking things is one of my bad traits T_T But I do think that the way in which the Dark XII are intelligent Heartless is very important - the only intelligent Heartless in existence is Xenahort's, and his Heartless is very special in the sense that it still has a heart (not only Xenahort's, but Terra's and Eraqus' as well) and it maintains human form. That made the least sense for me in terms of the main plot.

Uhuh, I did hear about the measures taken to refresh the main plot. Like I said in the posts above, I've only just come back, and I wasn't aware that work was underway - after all, all I had to go on was the main plot thread and the various fragmented world threads - and I was in no way trying to undermine all your hard work or anything. These are just a few thoughts and ideas, and are as much as for my own enjoyment as much as they are for contributing to the site.

Yes, the problem with Roxas also applies to Namine - how did she get extracted? I would've thought that at least some sort of logical concept except for the fact that they popped up would be required, surely? I'm just wondering if Roxas is there for the sake of having a Roxas - I think you either have him as an emotional existence inside Sora (which is what he is as a character) or have something with the powers, appearance and personality of Roxas, which I think is somewhat hollow... though I suppose that all the Org XIII want of Roxas is his ability to use the Keyblade, so I guess it could work for them.

[Rook]

Without saying too much about the plot and how things are to be unveiled... the only reason he's back is to make him a playable character. There is no logic that explains it, and any logic that you can apply to the situation is so against it even happening it's maddening. Despite my protests, the best explanation I got from those above me was ... "because".

All the best ways we thought of to bring him back were laid to waste by sticking him right back with the Organization, ruining him as a grown character, and forsaking any thing that could have brought him back.

For a character that causes so many problems that no one seems to want to play for any length of time, a lot of plot inconsistencies have been allowed just to stick his face on a banner.