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Ok. Since some recent issues have arisen about spells and Physics, I think we should establish some sort of Temp. range for some of the spells people use.
For example, in Kingdom Hearts we are never told how cold an Ice Spell is. For all we know it could be 32 F or even absolute ZERO. The problem is we just dont know. Fire is a problem here for pretty much the same reason. The Tep. is unknown.
Also, given that Heartless and Nobodies have relatively unknown INNER workings, its hard to tell what Temp. related spells do to thier systems.
I think it's reasonable to assume certain things. I don't think we need to bring mathematics and formulas into play. An Ice spell isn't going to be 32 degrees, it would be much lower than that, and the stronger the spell, the colder the ice will be. When Fire meets Ice, Fire wins. Water meets Fire, Water wins. Wind meets Water, Wind winds. Wind meets Ice, that depends on how much wind, and how hard the Ice is traveling, either way, it would be hard for the Ice to meet its intended target.
And Nobodies and Heartless, same thing. For all we know, the PEOPLE, humans living and breathing, might not have familiar workings, after all we've seen Hearts extraced from people and they aren't beating blood pumps, they are small lights in the shape of a heart (<3) with the magical power of holding their will and strengths. The only assumption we an really venture is that Heartless and Nobodies are fueled by the strength of Darkness and Nothingness, respectively, but unless their power of elements cancels it out, they would have the same reaction as a human would. They would freeze, they would burn, they would get electrocuted.
Excuse me? Are we still using the Final Fantasy element system that was deployed in Kingdom Hearts? Because if I recall correctly, its:
Fire <--> Ice Lightning <--> Water Earth <--> Wind Light <--> Darkness
Neutral: Poison, Gravity, Time, and if you want, Magnet
Those that aren't opposite are neutral to each other... So what's all this talk about this winning over that?
Now then, about the temperature thing, just assign something that seems logical for each level of spell. In the FF universe, there are a total of 4:
Standard -ra -ga -ja
Example: Cure Cura Curaga Curaja
However, with the exception of FFI, II, III, IV, and Tactics, only the first three spell levels are used. This is true as well in Kingdom Hearts, however, it is up to the GM as to whether or not to implement the 4th level (-ja) spell.
Also, don't over complicate it. For example, not saying necessarily use this, but:
Blizzard: 0 degrees F Blizzara: -30 degrees F Blizzaga: -60 degrees F Blizzaja: -90 degrees F
Or, if you wanna do it exponentially:
Blizzard: 0 Degrees F Blizzara: -20 Degrees F Blizzaga: -40 Degrees F Blizzaja: -80 Degrees F
Either way, keep consistency and simplicity in mind.
I think it's reasonable to assume certain things. I don't think we need to bring mathematics and formulas into play.
This.
Like I said, if we start overcomplicating it, it's going to go downhill fast. Spell power depends on the strength of the spell caster, but nature still takes hold in logic.
When you say: Fire <--> Ice You might want to explain what <--> is, because if it's supposed to mean equal or equivilant to or even polar opposites, that is completely inaccurate. Drop Ice into a flame. Fire wins everytime, unless you drop a large block of ice onto a much smaller fire, in which case in any amount of time the fire lived on before being extinguished, it still effected the ice.
This thread really doesn't need to happen. One short, small moment in understanding (in the cbox, no less, where reality has already been proven to be lacking consistence) hardly amounts to "some recent issues". It's never been a problem before, it will likely never be such again.
<--> is 'Opposite each other' or 'weak to each other'.
It can also be read:
Fire melts Ice <--> Ice chills Fire Lightning charges Water <--> Water disperses lightning Earth blocks Wind <--> Wind erodes Earth Light pierces Darkness <--> Darkness consumes Light
Also, keep in mind, we're not talking material counterparts here, we're talking manaeic/mystical/magical/whatever you wanna call it counterparts here.
So while yes, you're right about the material thing, just remember: It's MAGIC. After all, if Fire ALWAYS wins, then why are fire elementals WEAK to ice? (see: Red Noctrune, etc...)
So basically what I was saying was Don't chain the elements, that over complicates things. Just have them be opposites, just as in canon.
What canon? This site is notorious for sliding canon aside in favor of what's best and easiest for the members.
Hot and Cold are vastly different than Fire and Ice. You'd as soon change them to Hot spells and Cold spells instead of Fire spells and Ice spells. Red Nocturne's are weak to ice because it is counteractive to their element, but they are not made of that element, they are powered by it. Fire always wins over ice because that's logic. Overcomplicating is not "keeping what works", overcomplicating is trying to set into motion mathematics and reasoning to something that lacks the need for it.
Implementing this whole extra set of "but, ergo, therefores" is really unnecessary for the site. Even if you want to get it implemented, be prepared to bring it before the staff, and then wait for months on end.
Fire = Hot Fira = Really Hot Firaga = That's a spicy meatball!
Blizzard = Cold Blizzara = Very Cold Blizzaga = Welcome to Canada, eh.
Can we just leave it at that? I mean... what's the point?
Jesse Lar was quite the fire-breather he was, nothing up his sleeves, the fire was his own. Soon he seat aside a nice picnic outside of the Garden, he snapped his fingers, a small firaga spell soon making contact with the small sticks he'd found from around the area to warm them to a temperature of 540°. He then set aside his nice large, tender chocobo meat, cooking it rotisserie style until it had reached an inward temperature of 180°. Waiting several moments, he then ripped off the leg, gnawing away on it happily. Boy, it sure was finger lickin' good.
Yeah... Fantasy and Science make like God and Darwin.
... Now excuse me while I write the greatest fanfiction of all time about that.
Post by fearonaris on Mar 30, 2009 23:17:56 GMT -4
Ominous wind was confuzzled about hot and cold.
Now think people you cast firaga/blizaga you won't don't care how hot/cold it's going to be, all you care about is if it hit's that samuri that's about to give you a new belly button.
Unless of course you just go around casting random spells, which would be stupid you're wastin' your mana that way.
*Eye Twitch* I don't think I was "confuzzled" about anything Fearon. Yeah Hot is hot and cold is cold, I KNOW THIS ALREADY. (Its amazing how many people on here thought I didn't)
Post by fearonaris on Mar 31, 2009 20:29:04 GMT -4
I was joking! It was meant for comedy! *whispers to self "Sorry, geez some people just can't take jokes."
I'm just pointing out if your getting attacked, you don't care the exact Temp. of your spell, you just care how hot it is, that's all. I know you know, I'm not questioning your intellegence... I've got to learn to be a bit more serious
Post by fearonaris on Mar 31, 2009 20:57:02 GMT -4
Okay then, Let's all go to one of the many pointless threads here and talk about something totally meaningless... or we can stay here talking about, well like Rook said, over-and-done-with conversations.